My interview with Rafe Spall and Esther Smith of “TRYING” from AppleTV+

I couldn’t thank Rafe Spall and Esther Smith enough for coming to the blazing hot summer sun of Phoenix to have a little chat with me. Spall and Smith are the leads in an AppleTV+ series called “TRYING” about a couple who have tried to have a child but now find themselves trying to adopt. The process isn’t as easy as one might imagine.

Apple is putting out remarkable shows. “Trying” is incredibly good. It’s intense at times, tender at times and can be emotional yet funny. Just as life can be. It’s as real as it gets, and you’re as involved as you can be without knowing the characters in real life. The show works on so many levels; most importantly, as I’ve mentioned, you being invested right away in these two. Will they succeed in what they’re attempting to do? Will their relationship suffer? Sit down and watch these fabulous actors maneuver around this storyline, wooing you all the while. -SHARI K. GREEN

*Season Three is out, with one of the final two episodes showing tonight, August 26, and the final episode airing on September 2nd.


TMC: I like that Nikki and Jason are supportive of one another. They’re a strong couple who have the same goals, a united front, you could say. I think it really works for the show because when people try to adopt a child, that’s difficult enough. These characters have issues along the way, but they’re not fighting one another. It’s a fantastic aspect of the show; how do you feel about it?


RAFE: I think it’s very real. I think that it’s quite aspirational, really. That’s what you want, in your own life, to have a relationship like Nikki and Jason where they’ve faced adversity. And it may well cause arguments sometimes but after the arguments, after the disagreements, their relationship deepens. I think that’s really wonderful; beautiful. They, you know, seemingly have found the right person. And a really wonderful thing Nikki said at the end of the First Season, she says, even if this doesn’t work, even if this doesn’t work (getting the kids), you’re enough, it’s enough, we’re enough.

I think that’s a really beautiful sentiment. It’s something that we can all aspire to is finding that person that sees us, accepts us for who we are. All we want to be, as humans, is to be seen and they really see each other. And I think they’re a great couple and I love them.

When we finish a season, I miss them.


TMC: Nikki calls Jason “Jase.” Those are the little things that make this show so relatable and endears your characters to the audience. Did you come up with the nickname or was it written in?


ESTHER: Oh my gosh. I can’t even remember. It feels like it was something that was so… I think that we sometimes slightly get in trouble cuz I definitely add in more Jases than are written in the script, just because that feels like such a normal, natural thing. If someone’s annoying you or as a term of endearment, I definitely add more in, but I can’t remember whether it was originally—

RAFE: I think it was a mix of both.


RAFE: And I think it’s something that has happened during the show for a while, cuz the whole show is written by one guy, Andy Wolton, which in this day and age is unheard of to have written twenty-eight episodes singlehandedly. It’s crazy.

He’s actually written to our voices, as well. He’s written to our specific speech patterns and way of speaking. There is some room for improvisation but most of the funny stuff in the show, ninety-nine-point nine percent of the good stuff in the show is written by him. But we do add the odd thing every now and again.


TMC: Because the first three seasons were written by the show’s creator, with the exception of one episode so far, has been directed by, I think, the co-creator?


RAFE: No. He wasn’t the co-creator. Jim O’Hanlon directed the first two seasons in their entirety. The beginning four were directed by Elliot Hegarty.


TMC: How did that aid both of you in terms of being able to prepare for the roles and be able to bring yourselves, as actors, into the roles?


ESTHER: By having Jim, kind of, there? Do you know what’s really lovely (I love how she says “lovely” by the way) about this show now, from the privileged position of having done Three Seasons of it is that (clears throat) it feels like it’s this family where we kind of return to. And not just in terms of like cast and crew members, everyone involved in that. Particularly like the mainstays like someone like Jim O’Hanlon who’s so incredible and he’s such an actor’s director. He’s so encouraging and listens to you… your ideas and will kind of say something which will make me think of something differently. He’s a real (thinks) yeah, it does feel like you have such an ease with the people you have been creating this thing, for like these three years with… a real shorthand. And, of course, inevitably, that makes it a really lovely ease on set because of that. Because you do feel comfortable and that makes you feel relaxed, which, hopefully, makes you then perform better. Yeah, he really allows a lot of –


RAFE: Yeah. He was around in the beginning. It’s interesting that you call him a co-creator because he sort of is, you know? The creator of the show is definitely Andy Wolton. Well, actually, a gentleman called Chris Sussman who was the head of comedy at BBC Studios who are the production company responsible for making the show, even though it’s obviously paid for and made by Apple.

But the production company… they’re different. It’s not the BBC. It’s not publicly funded. They are a production company and strand of the BBC.

There’s a guy called Chris Sussman who met this writer called Andy Wolton who pitched a few ideas to him, and it came out that Andy himself was adopted and he was like, ‘Why don’t you write something about that?’ So, it was Chris Sussman’s idea. Andy Wolton went away and wrote it. And again, then Sussman went and pitched a few ideas to Apple and was like, ‘Oh. I’ve got this big…’ because, at the time, Apple wasn’t looking for comedy. Apple Europe and Jay Hunt… she wasn’t looking for comedy. But was like, you know, ‘This is a great idea.’ Commissioned it. It was one of Apple Europe’s first commissions. And so, they hired Jim O’Hanlon after we were cast. So, we got cast first and then Jim came on board. We have a slightly different system in England. We don’t have a show-runner system, but he would be something akin to a showrunner but also directs the show, too. Uh, he’s an extremely experienced, brilliant, versatile director who has filled us with a bunch of encouragement, really, and has made us feel good and held and secure.


ESTHER: He trusts us with our roles and that’s so lovely to, kind of, have that.

RAFE: Because it can be strange, again, if you’re on a relatively long-running TV show, you know the characters really well and then you get lots of different directors coming in, I think that’s difficult for directors to come in and do that and we’ve managed to have a really nice continuity. And also, the beginning four of season three, Elliot Hegarty did a really good job, as well. He’s also directed Ted Lasso and things like that, so he’s worked for Apple, but Jim’s a massive part of the show.


TMC: You can tell there’s an ease between the entire cast that translates very well onscreen.


RAFE: I think that’s really important. You want… it’s gotta seem real. People talk a lot about our chemistry which is integral to the show. If it was real, relaxed and even though you have some set pieces that may be, on paper, slightly heightened, they’re all rooted in reality. I think that’s really important because we’re dealing with a very sensitive subject matter and we’re using levity and comedy in order to… as a sort of conduit, but it’s very important that everything feels real, and I think that we’ve done a pretty good job of that. If I may say so myself.


TMC: Talking about the ensemble. Scott and Karen. They’re not the perfect couple, not the perfect match. At first, I was not generally happy with them being together, but I’ve grown to enjoy them more. How do Jason and Nikki feel about Karen and Scott as a couple and if the adoption goes through, would they be their godparents?


ESTHER: That’s interesting. I think, maybe similarly to you, I feel like Nikki definitely had huge reservations about Scott being part of (she laughs) the family but I think as it’s gone on, I think he… them as a couple, they somehow work and I love watching them. I love watching their scenes together. I never; we obviously never get to see that.

We get to read it on a script and then we just focus on your part of the story and then it’s a real lovely treat when you’re watching it all back and there’s this other world going on. I find them heartbreaking. I find them hilarious. And they do really work… and I think the more we go on… I like to think that Nikki and Jason, perhaps… tolerate Scott (everyone laughs). They tolerate him.


RAFE: But also, they, you know, like at the end of the Second Season where they get married, and we see the effort that he’s made in creating that beautiful garden party and stuff, you’re like, ‘Oh! He means well.’ And he’s obviously a very vulnerable character. That’s what I mean. Andy’s written this character that could seem a little heightened but roots him with heart. He’s full of heart.

ESTHER: There’s always those lovely little bits and pieces, like in series one where Karen’s really cold and they’re coming out of the tube station and he wraps his scarf around her and you’re like, ‘Oh. Underneath all this, you love her. You’re just like all of us.’ Perhaps we’re all presenting a different version of ourselves to protect ourselves.


TMC: In this day and age, with overpopulation, drought and the planet warming up, do you think their story is important to tell? The adoption vs. having more children organically?


RAFE: Yeah. I think its representation is incredibly important. I mean, I think that it would be disingenuous to say that was the objective of this storyline because it isn’t. This is a couple who’ve tried to conceive naturally, and they haven’t been blessed with that ability. So, I can’t really talk to the politics of it, but I think in terms of representation, in terms of people that, umm, the one in seven people are affected by infertility, that it’s really wonderful, again, for people to be seen for that story to be represented because it is something that touches a lot of people’s lives and is, sort of, great pain to very many folks. So, I can say that that’s great that we represent that but the political aspect of that, I can’t really talk to because it would be disingenuous.


ESTHER: Yeah. What’s been a really lovely bonus of this show is the amount of people that reach out, who are going through it, who are either going through the process or they’re having fertility struggles and they… it’s like a lovely stream of people constantly getting in touch, kind of, saying that they feel seen by it, they feel like it’s an accurate portrayal of what they have gone through. They see themselves in these two characters and actually, most importantly, that they don’t feel alone with it. I think, particularly over the last couple of years, going through that during the pandemic. I just… I can’t even imagine what– you need your kind of people, a community around you to support you in that. And then having to do that without that, has got to have been incredibly hard but I think that what has been interesting about doing the show is that I’ve learnt the process of it is not easy, and it’s hard and it’s so great to be able to be a source of, I don’t know, maybe comfort for people in that. Yeah.


TMC: Imelda (Staunton; Harry Potter), who plays social worker, Penny, is in their corner. How important is it that Penny is a supportive character for Jason and Nikki? Terribly important because they’re new to the process, right?


ESTHER: Absolutely, and I feel like they need, particularly in this process because it’s something that has taken them a lot to kind of… to have the courage to go, ‘Do you know what? Yeah. Let’s go down this route.’

I think they need as many people on their side, and also people… what I love about Imelda’s character in this is that she’s not this quote-unquote ‘normal,’ what you’d expect, social worker. She kind of is, like, ‘play it as it comes,’ ‘bit by bit,’ ‘step by step.’

The first time we meet her, she’s holding up a piece of her clothing because someone has thrown ‘wee’ on it. (Laughs) And she leaves it outside and she just kind of bustles in and… I think she plays with these two people particularly well because I think Nikki and Jason are also two people who, you know, are maybe ‘square peg, round hole’ people. Particularly, Nikki, I think.

They’re not following a traditional blueprint, what they thought their blueprint was gonna be. And I think Penny really speaks to that and is probably this voice of wisdom somehow. She’s a few steps ahead of them in life and kind of—

RAFE: But also, there’s no antagonist in the show. That’s quite refreshing. There’s no baddies. Everyone’s ‘Trying’ to do the right thing. And to have someone of her caliber, Oscar-nominated, one of our finest actors in the world. Obviously, there’s a lack of her in Season Three, that’s because she’s now the queen of England. (Laughs) We can only hope we do more when she’s finished her reign. Perhaps she’ll come back and hang out with the peasants again.


TMC: There’s some tension, obviously, between Nikki and Princess. You don’t have any kids, right?


ESTHER: No, I don’t.

TMC: Not being a parent yourself, what do you pull from to make this come across so sincerely?

ESTHER: I think maybe on some aspects, maybe it’s…I guess there’s two camps to this because maybe it’s helpful that I’m not a parent because Nikki isn’t a parent and then she becomes one quite quickly with someone who’s older. So, she doesn’t have the experience of knowing this person, so I think maybe that’s probably been a helpful thing perhaps. What I find completely heartbreaking about the Nikki Princess things is that Nikki tries so hard and she’s such a good person. She just wants the best but inevitably, you can’t control what a person, especially (thinks). Princess is ten in this. What a ten-year-old is gonna be like, particularly a ten-year-old who’s probably got a lot of trauma from whatever they’ve been through in their life, and Nikki is just so, kind of, patient with her and so present with her that, yeah, I find it completely heartbreaking but I also love that it’s also given Nikki something, too. She really wants it, so she’s really fighting up against it.


RAFE: Also, from an outsider’s point of view, Esther really is as lovely with Eden (Togwell), who plays Princess, as Nikki is with Princess. Esther’s really kind and gorgeous and lovely with her, so (to Esther) it comes naturally to you, I’d imagine.

ESTHER: I think it’s really because we have the advantage of being with these two little kids off-set, as well. We have a lot of prep time that you do get to bond with them, and you do get to form your own relationships with them. And also, we’re lucky because they’re both really lovely kids. They found two really (thinks) brilliant actors, I think.

RAFE: Yeah. They’re good.

ESTHER: Even though they hadn’t done it before. (Chuckles)


TMC: One of the things I admire about the show is that you as a couple aren’t married. It’s a modern way of telling a couple’s story while retaining your individuality as characters. What was your process like, at the beginning of the series, to bring yourselves together while retaining your own individuality?


ESTHER: That’s such a good question. Umm, I felt like, before we got the jobs, we had this chemistry read together to see if we had the correct chemistry. Trying to prove that in front of people you don’t know that you’ve got chemistry with someone you don’t know (she laughs) that you’ve got chemistry is just funny. Umm, and I think there is, I mean, (pointing to Rafe) you speak to this really eloquently that there’s this extra thing that when two people are performing, it’s not the people, it’s the energy between them. Which I think is so true. And that’s… that’s what’s created.


RAFE: I think that’s what’s interesting from an audience’s point of view is that it’s not Esther or I; it’s what we create together. And I think that because that’s what we respond to because that’s what’s organic… that’s what’s created. That’s what’s like, you know, lighting in a bottle as it were. So, we had to have this chemistry read because chemistry’s there or it’s not. It can’t be engineered or manufactured; it just happens. I don’t know why but I know that the only way that I can play my part towards engendering it, is just by keeping up with Esther. And I just listen to her I respond to her.

She’s so alive and I think that’s really all that we can hope for in any kind of performative acting, interpretation, whatever want to call it, is that it’s alive. It just needs to be alive and real.


TMC: It’s organic.


RAFE: Organic. Yeah. And, you know, I think a lot of it doesn’t even seem written. That’s why people say some of it’s improvised because it flows so naturally in such a real way. It feels sort of lofty and the tiny bits of beauty in the every day, in which he’s very good at picking out and working on, I think is one of the great merits of the show.


TMC: The other thing I captured in seeing the series is that you both have individual ideals. As you said, you bring that energy together and they become joined. I consider your relationship to be on an equitable level of a traditional marriage. That’s what really impresses me about the flow of the show and your characters in general. You feed off each other very, very well.


RAFE: Families come in all different shapes and sizes. It’s not just the nuclear 2.4; married and then kids. These guys weren’t able to conceive naturally, they’re not married at this point, and they love each other… and family means many different things. Many different things.

Film Description

Before they become parents, they have to grow up. Watch all episodes of Trying now on the Apple TV app with an Apple TV+ subscription: All Nikki (Esther Smith) and Jason (Rafe Spall) want is a baby—but it’s the one thing they just can’t have. How are they going to fill the next 50 years if they can’t start a family? They already went through The Sopranos in a weekend. After ruling out every other option, Nikki and Jason decide to adopt and are confronted by a world of bewildering new challenges.


With their dysfunctional friends, screwball family, and chaotic lives, will the adoption panel agree that they’re ready to be parents? Co-starring BAFTA Award winner Imelda Staunton, Ophelia Lovibond, and Oliver Chris, and written by Andy Wolton, Trying is a new comedy series from Apple TV+ and BBC Studios about a thirtysomething couple and their friends learning to grow up, settle down, and find someone to love.



Andy Wolton


Jim O’Hanlon, Elliot Hegarty 


Rafe Spall, Esther Smith, Oliver Chris, Sian Brooke and Imelda Staunton


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My interview with the gang behind the Super Troopers Franchise! ‘Super Troopers 2’ comes out tomorrow!!

Having just watched the screening of Super Troopers 2 the night before, I had a really fun time when a very small group of us press members sat down with most of Broken Lizard, the men behind the hilarious film franchise, the next afternoon for a bull session.

I could have talked to them all day but was, unfortunately, given a time limit. I spoke to Jay Chandrasekhar, the member of the five-man comedy troupe who directs the films, the night before, but only slightly as I hadn’t realized in time that he wasn’t going to be joining in on the interview or I would have brought my recorder to get a quote or two for this piece. Luckily for us, the four who were there, Erik Stolhanske, Steve Lemme, Paul Soter and Kevin Heffernan were chatty enough and quite entertaining, as was their film.

In fact, I was nervous for them as I went into the screening because often times films suffer from the sophomore jinx, but ‘Super Troopers 2’ is not one of them. They were happy to hear that I felt that way about their efforts as they were worried, themselves.

Read on because they also hint of a ‘part three’ which sounds intriguing. I say, ‘Go for it!’ Why stop now? But they made us wait long enough for this film… they need to get moving already, right?!  I digress.

Interestingly enough, the most serious of the bunch was Kevin, known to most as the frustrating but cuddly ‘Farva.’ He had a more contemplative tone and seemed to analyze the questions more before forming his responses, which, here and the night before at the screening, seemed to be direct and to the point rather than trying to fit some mold a person may have expected from him.

Steve (Mac) is the more playful in the group. The class clown, so to speak. They all fit that description, in a way, but he seems to always be on. When not speaking, he’s waiting to speak, however, does give the speaker his ear. He’s genuine and warm and a pleasure to get to know.

Erik (Rabbit) is the quiet one but he’s not shy. He’s very sweet. Respectful. You can tell when talking to him that he was reserved as a youngster. He’s the one who politely waits his turn to speak and sometimes gets skipped. No member is rude toward the other, don’t mistake what I’m about to say, but like brothers often do, they jump on top of one another, metaphorically speaking, in certain situations which can turn into a free-for-all. If it does, someone gets left at the bottom. Erik may sometimes take a place at or near the bottom but seems comfortable there. What I mean is, if you watch him, his wheels are always turning. When it’s his turn to work or speak, he’ll burst from the pile and you better watch out. Don’t get in his way. This is all conjecture, by the way… just an observance.

Paul (Foster) is a little of all these characteristics rolled into one. He’s studious and insightful and he respects the audience, as they all do. They share a mutual appreciation for their fans and are aware they’d be nowhere without them. Knowing this, they’re very approachable and grateful.

Broken Lizard. A brotherhood has been created here and it was fun to witness it come to life. They finish each other’s thoughts and are hip to where the other is going with a point, cognizant of where each one stands on a subject. There’s a comradery, a reverence and admiration between them, that I’d say will never break.

Kevin starts by talking about the film.

Kevin: There was a lot of pressure about whether people were going to like this movie or not. Because there’s so many fans of the first one that they don’t want you to screw it up. Inevitably the concern that they raise to you, even in those groups, you know, it’s like, ‘I was so afraid it was going to suck!’ My wife said the same thing.

Paul: Our fans have never been shy about saying what they feel because you get people every day, like, ‘Yeah! Loved ‘Super Troopers!’ ‘Club Dread’ sucked.’ Or ‘I loved ‘Beerfest’ but ‘The Slammin’ Salmon’ sucked.’ So, we know people. That’s actually good. That’s helpful to see. What’s working and what people like. I think it’s nice; the response. We’ve shown the movie a few of times, especially to the Indigogo backers, people are so positive. I really believe they’re satisfied.

Question: Do you think that’s because they have a stake in your game?

Kevin: Maybe. I think it’s more of a wedding toast kind of situation, like, they want you to succeed. They’re on your side. You’re like family, right? So, you can go up there and, hopefully, not screw it up.

Steve: Kevin’s right. You feel a sense of release. I mean, from us, too. We just didn’t want to suck and thankfully it doesn’t. A lot of people are saying it’s as good as the first one, maybe better, so…

Paul: Yeah and certainly, we spent a lot of time on both scripts, but I think that what I like here is we spent more time thinking about what makes a good story or what makes a good movie so, you look at the first one and we’ll admit that it’s really, sort of, an excuse for set pieces after set pieces but we really wanted this to be something with an interesting story and you wanted to know how it ends and a cool hook about this chunk of Canada and, you know, I think we’ve ‘plus upped’ just the story telling of it.

Erik: Let’s face it. We made a great movie.

They all laugh and talk over each other having a great time, most likely, remembering moments of making this film as they smiled with congratulatory grins. All earned.

Then Paul jumps in with a worried face.

Paul: He just jinxed the shit out of us.

Question: When writing, what type of research did you do, in terms of Canada? I know that Bruce McCulloch (Kids in the Hall) was on set but, myself, I’d watch ‘Strange Brew’ or ‘Kids in the Hall’ or something like that, but did you pull from your past or do research or–

Erik: Yeah. I lived up there for about ten years.

Kevin: We had a lot of interaction. There were times when we’d go up there and, you know, have fun.

Erik: And for Touring and stand-up.

Kevin: There were times when we’d go to Montreal for the Just for Laughs Festival and you’d be in that area and there were… funny elements of it. There’s a lot of French Canadians who don’t want to speak English to you. There were a lot who were kind of gruff when it’s normally the Canadians who you think are nice people but they– so it was kind of a cool area; thought it would be fun to have some fun with it.

Steve: Plus, we’re neighbors and we know nothing about each other, truthfully, you know? We were in Calgary and we met a Canadian person who was saying some untruths about Americans and we’re like, do you know anything about the United States? How many states do we have? And he’s like, ‘I don’t know forty-eight?’ And we’re like, ‘Holy shit! That’s a ridiculous answer.’ And he’s like, ‘Well, how many provinces are in Canada?’ And we’re like, ‘I don’t know.’

Erik: What’s a province?  

Paul: Forty-Eight? Seventy? That, to me, is why we left every joke in the movie is because, at the end, it looks like we’re all friends again and then Linda Carter basically says, ‘No. It’s going to be status quo again.’ And we immediately turn on each other. And that ‘Burn down your White House, again!’ and ‘What the hell are you talking about?!’ ‘The war of 1812. Learn your history.’ That’s my favorite joke because it is like, we didn’t even know our own history.

Kevin: We were in Calgary and someone, one of the Canadians, was telling us this whole story about how they burned down the White House and we were like, ‘What?! We don’t remember it that way!’

Steve: I had never heard that before. We were like, ‘The war of 1812 you burned down the White House? That doesn’t even sound familiar.’ We looked it up on Wikipedia. ‘No, actually, the Brits were renting YOUR land and THEY burnt down the White House in the war of 1812.’ But the Canadians were like, ‘No. We did it.’ We’ll let them have that one. We’ll give it to them. It’s fun.

Erik: Sure.

Steve: We also didn’t realize they didn’t become a real independent nation until 1983.

Paul: The more you dig around, it’s just fun… just funny stuff; the real history.

Steve: But we don’t just take the piss out of them, you know? If you watch the movie, we’re the ones who come over the border and we’re making fun of them. We’re the ugly Americans. And then it gets flipped immediately and we’re kind of the bad guys.

Kevin: We cast Canadians in those lead roles, Will Sasso and Tyler Labine, Emmanuelle Chriqui; they’re all Canadian and we kind of brought that whole thing to the table.

Erik: And they’re all from different parts. Will’s from Vancouver, Tyler’s from Ontario and Emmanuelle’s from Montreal… it’s such a wide range.

Steve: And our philosophy with Broken Lizard, comedy wise, is never to be mean-spirited and never to pick on anybody. We’re joking about how silly Canada is but the point was that we were setting ourselves up intentionally to have these guys smear us all over the place. That’s the thing about Canadians. They don’t take themselves too seriously.

Erik: I showed some clips up in Toronto a couple of weeks ago and they were very excited.

Question: Jay isn’t here right now so this is your chance to tell us about him.

Steve: Our chance to bash him? Terrible director. Terrible actor.

Question: C’mon. Give me something juicy.

They laugh.

Paul: He sleeps with his eyes open and snores really loudly.

Steve: It’s freaky as hell.

Paul: Days where we would share a hotel room and sometimes even share a bed with the guy, like, you’d wake up and he’d be staring at you and he’s snoring.

One of the four makes a snoring sound.

Erik: I wonder if he’s human.

Paul: And he’s deaf in one ear.

Kevin: It was also fun to have him direct this movie because… since the first Super Troopers movie, he’s directed 100 episodes of TV so he does have a different rhythm now than he did then and it was kinda cool to see how he did things a little bit differently. It was more about pacing and having efficient coverage. So, he definitely learned, you know?

Steve: This is my impression of Jay Chandrasekhar, (deepens his voice; speaks slowly) ’Uh… speak faster.’ (They laugh)

Paul: But I feel for him because he has to direct and act, which, I don’t think about how hard it is until I watch him. You can see he’s acting but his wheels are turning as a director and you have to snap him out of it. Brian Cox did that a couple of times, which is the great thing about having someone like Brian Cox on set sometimes. He wants to make sure you have your shit together as a director but as an actor too, so it makes you up your game.

Steve: And Brian Cox, naturally, when the sun starts going down, he starts to get a little crusty. He certainly doesn’t have time for any tomfoolery.

(Laughing, Crosstalk)

Steve: Cuz when the sun goes down, we start to become a bunch of monkey’s.

Erik: In Trooper, we worked him too hard. We worked him overnight.

Paul: He’s awesome. His eyeball exploded ¾’s of the way through the shoot. What happened with him? A blood vessel burst—

Kevin: He burst a blood vessel in his eye so, as a matter of continuity, we had to go in and digitally remove the red from his eye for certain scenes, otherwise, in his closeup you would have seen that his eyes was all—

Erik: Terrifying.

Steve: If you know which scenes the blood vessel burst for, which we do, now I can only focus on the white of his eye and it’s brighter than it normally should be.

Kevin: We won’t give those secrets away. You can see it on the DVD.

Erik: I mean, I’ve seen it. I’ve seen Steve reacting to it.

Eric suddenly looks horrified and alarmed. The room bursts into laughter at the memory.

Erik: That bloody eyeball was right there. Makes you jump.

Steve: A bloody eyeball is a terrifying thing.

Paul: He has a malevolent presence at times. He’s a jovial guy and he loves doing these things with us but when he turns to you with a big bloody eye…it’s the stuff of nightmares.

Question: I enjoyed the hell out of the movie. You guys don’t take yourselves seriously and you’re very passionate about what you do and it comes through in spades but you’re never rude about it like, we know you make fun of the Canadians but you don’t blame the Canadians’ right?

All: Right.

Question: Your passion shows through. So, what influences you, beyond the sequel, what influences you as actors to want to continue these characters?

Kevin and Steve argue over who’s going to answer the question first.

Kevin: A lot of this is based on us being friends. And it’s on… the philosophy is, ‘Hey, we’re gonna create this world and you can come and hang out in our world with us and be happy and be comfortable in this world because we’re having a good time; you’re having a good time.’ And so, I think that influences us to want to do these worlds in this way, you know?

Steve: That’s what I was gonna say. And we have drafts of things where the guys are bickering with each other or arguing, and we look at it, ‘No… no. We don’t want it to be that way.’ These guys are just joking around and having fun with each other and there’s the one asshole that everybody has in their workplace that’s gonna come in and ruin everybody’s good time and that’s this guy (gestures to Kevin) and so any obnoxious line that isn’t pc or not what we want someone to say, we just pop them into his mouth and we can get away with it.

Kevin: But you still like me.

Steve: But we still like you.

Erik: You’re lovable.

Kevin: Thank you.

Paul: The guy you love to hate.

Steve: And now we have a French-Canadian version of Farva, too (Paul Walter Hauser).

Question: From ‘I, Tonya,’ right?

Kevin: From ‘I, Tonya.’ What’s a great story is that I had done a comedy show with him, a live show… I had met him. And so, we’re trying to cast a Canadian Farva and I was like, ‘This guy I met; he’s fantastic. Let’s have him come in.’ So, we sent him to the casting director to go on tape for our movie and so we did our movie and they were casting for ‘I, Tonya’ and it was the same casting director and she was like, ‘I’m gonna call that guy in again cuz he was so great.’ And she called him in for, ‘I Tonya,’ and he got the part because he did ‘Super Troopers,’ which we were so excited for him about. And now the guy’s taking off. He’s in Spike Lee’s new movie (BlacKkKlansman). He’s done a bunch of stuff since.

Paul: It’s like we’re going around launching everybody’s career except our own.

Kevin: It’s good. It’s exciting.

Question: So, ‘Rabbit’ gets a love interest!?

Erik: Yeah! I’m tired of being shaving creamed!

Paul: That’s the last thing I want to do, is do the love stuff. Go and make-out and be mushy and have to do real acting? But, as silly as our movies get, you still have to have that scene. You still have to have that.

Question: Is there a girl out there for Farva?

Kevin: I don’t know. We talked about that. Maybe in ‘Super Troopers 3,’ we talked about maybe Farva finally finds his love. Maybe. But for now, I locked lips with Lemme in the movie, so… yeah… I’ll stay with Mac. Farva and Mac having a moment.

Steve: Pretty romantic stuff.

Kevin: Why not do it with the guy you know.

Paul: There’s no mushiness here.

Steve: That would be a great thing. In ‘Super Troopers 3,’ (gestures to Kevin) if Mac says, ‘I need to talk to you for a second. I can’t stop thinking about you.’

They laugh.

Question: Tell me about the writing process. How do you bring it all together?

Paul: It’s like this. It’s us around a table and there’s sort of these stages of just general ideation. Obviously, the world had already been built so that was good but generally speaking, we ask, ‘Where do we want to go with this?’ You, sort of, refine with each phase of starting, ‘Okay. Let’s go with that… let’s beat it out, how would something like that work?’ And with every phase, you’re almost always just throwing out bits or set pieces or comedy that you keep off to the side and you kind of build the structure of the storytelling. It’s just about populating as much comedy as you can.

Steve: Yeah. ‘Lonnie Laloush,’ the Canadian Farva, is a great example of that cuz that’s something where he just existed as dialogue. Down the road we thought, ‘We should probably see this guy.’ So, we wrote him into one scene but then we loved his audition tape so much we were, like, ‘God. We gotta see this guy a bunch and American Farva and Canadian Farva should meet up with each other at some point so… you just keep rolling it out and with each new draft, you have three, five, ten more jokes. It just makes the script better.

Question: Does anyone ever get their feelings hurt?

Kevin: Yeah. It definitely happens.

Erik: I’d say it happens.

Paul: Not over a joke but…

Kevin: We’re passionate.

Paul: We are passionate but it’s not necessarily a ‘This is funny.’ ‘No, it’s not.’ ‘Yes, it is.’ ‘No it’s not!’ The fights seem to be more, ‘Is it, at all, realistic?’ It tends to be more tonal stuff like, ‘That’s too broad, like a Zucker Brother’s joke. It’s funny but I don’t know if it exists in that world.’ Then the guys tend to roll up their sleeves.

Erik: Sometimes it’s like ‘Survivor’ where you have to form an alliance. Like, if you have a joke you’re trying, you have to get three out of five people on your side to get the joke approved. (Kevin laughs) So, often times, you’re trying to form alliances. Sometimes you even have to act it out. If you catch my joke but someone else isn’t seeing it, you have to get on your feet and sell it.

Paul: But then you can also sabotage a joke by reading it in a shitty voice. (Mocks a bad reading of a joke.) ‘Well, when you read it like that, asshole, of course it’s not funny!’

Erik: Right.

Paul: That’s the best way to sabotage.

Steve: But that’s the problem, too. When you get in these creative disputes, after the first round of, ‘Hey. I don’t know if this’llwork.’ It becomes, you just want to win a fight! And so now you got guys who have their heels dug in and there’re just going toe to toe. And three guys will just sit back and watch it. Like, we’ll smirk at each other while these other two guys are just butting heads.

Paul: And when you’re one of those combatants and you want support from the other guys, you’ll always get shot down because there’s nothing more fun than when you’re one of those guys watching two guys fight. And you don’t want to get involved. You just wanna sit back and eat popcorn and watch it. But it’s also maddening when you’re like, ‘Come on! Help me out here!’ And the other guy’s like, ‘You guys figure it out.’

Erik: You’re doing great. Hang in there.

Question: Kevin, you have a law degree.

Kevin: I do.

Question: You passed the bar in two states.

Kevin: I did. In two states. Yeah.

Question: If you became a lawyer and didn’t do this, looking and watching these guys, how would you feel about them?

Kevin: I’d feel they need a Farva, these guys!

Erik: Everybody needs a Farva.

Question: Any other careers anyone else were considering, instead of doing this? Your passion?

Steve: I don’t know what else I would do.


Erik: I don’t think we’re qualified for anything else.

Paul: I had a desk job for, like, one month.

Kevin: You guys could come work for me at the law firm if you want. Come make some copies for me. Do some research for me.

Paul: That’s good to know.

I believe he would. I hope you liked this interview. I know you’ll like the movie.

Interview with Anthony Gonzalez from the movie ‘Coco’

My second interview of the year was with young actor and singer, Anthony Gonzalez, who was touring for the film he starred in which releases this month on Blu-ray, DVD and Digital.  Anthony brought the wonderful character Miguel to life in the Disney•Pixar film, “Coco” which is Pixar Animation Studios’ 19th feature film.  In the movie, Miguel dreams of becoming a polished musician and for such a young man he’s, much like Anthony himself, well on the way.  Not only can Anthony act with the best of them but he has been singing almost his entire life, a talent he picked up from watching his older siblings.  It’s appropriate to proclaim he has a beautiful singing voice and he’ll go far with it.  He’s also passing the tradition of performing on to his younger brother.  Read on to learn more about this sweet person, Anthony Gonzalez, so you can prepare for when you hear much more about him.

Q: Tell me about ‘Coco’

AG: ‘Coco’ is about a boy named Miguel who loves music, that’s his passion, but he has to keep his passion for music a secret because his family has banned it because what has happened with his family in past generations.  He kinda struggles with that because he doesn’t have the support from his family. Because of that, he goes on a magical journey through the Land of the Dead and where he gets to meet his idol, Ernesto de la Cruz. Yeah, I really loved doing the movie and the two things I love to do and have been doing since I was four years old! I have never sang and acted in the same project so that was amazing, especially all the amazing songs that ‘Coco’ has!

Q: What was your favorite part of the film?

AG: I have a lot of favorite parts but one of them is when Miguel is getting ready to sing Poco Loco. I also love a lot of the scenes where Miguel is interacting with Mama Coco because I feel like that’s so sweet.

Q: Okay, now what was your favorite song from the movie?

AG: I really love Proud Corazón a lot because I love the message that it gives. It talks about the family and I love the melody, it’s so catchy. That’s the one I sing the most. I, obviously, love Poco Loco because that one is just so much fun! Remember Me or Poco Loco was the first ones I recorded and that was so much fun.

Remember Me… I love the song so much because of the message. When I was singing it, I got the emotion because I really connected a lot with Miguel singing this to Mama Coco and it really reminded me of my grandfather who passed away when I was six. He was very special for me because he was always there for me and he would support me. He inspired me. When my mom would take my brother to singing competitions, he would tell my mom, ‘Take Anthony, too, because he loves to sing and he’s good at it!’ So, I definitely thank him. It was really emotional for me to get to sing, Remember Me. It was a way for me to connect with my grandfather again and be with him again. It was an amazing experience to get to record it.

I also love The World Es Mi Familia because the message… the world is my family, music is my language… it really shows the love Miguel has for music.

Q: I was wondering what it was like being in the sound booth for you. Was it hard to do that and were you finding yourself really getting into it?

AG: At first, I was like a bit nervous because when I was ten I went to Pixar. It was my first time there and they were telling me about the movie and that was the first time I really knew it was a Disney•Pixar movie so I was, like, ‘Wow!’ I was a bit nervous the first time but then after I started to go a lot more often, I kinda got used to it.  I love this movie a lot because, umm… I really identified myself with Miguel a lot because we both have a passion for music and we both know the importance of family and, yeah, it was so much fun doing the role of Miguel; especially alongside the amazing director Lee Unkrich.  And the amazing producer Darla K. Anderson and co-director Adrian Molina were just an incredible help when I was recording.

Q: Generally, you work with other people when acting but what’s it like to work on building up that enthusiasm when you’re alone in the sound booth?

AG: At first, I was like a bit nervous because when I was ten I went to Pixar. It was my first time there and they were telling me about the movie and that was the first time I really knew it was a Disney•Pixar movie so I was, like, ‘Wow!’ I was a bit nervous the first time but then after I started to go a lot more often, I kinda got used to it.  I love this movie a lot because, umm… I really identified myself with Miguel a lot because we both have a passion for music and we both know the importance of family and, yeah, it was so much fun doing the role of Miguel; especially alongside the amazing director Lee Unkrich.  And the amazing producer Darla K. Anderson and co-director Adrian Molina were just an incredible help when I was recording.

Q: That’s obvious to me now. So, you won the Annie Award for Best Voice Acting in an Animated Feature.

AG: Yes. That was amazing!

He uses the word amazing a lot, which so fits his personality. He also smiles a lot with a massive grin that brightens any room and is very animated as he speaks. He seems to constantly be in motion, unable to contain the energy coursing through him.

Q: What did that mean to you to win an award?

AG: That was just incredible because when they told me, ‘You’re nominated for an Annie Award,’ I was like, ‘Oh…uh…cool. I don’t know what that is.’ But then the director told me it was like the Oscars but in animation. I was like, ‘Wow!’ That’s a big deal for animation! And I was just so happy I was nominated. But something a director told me was, ‘Never expect anything.’ Because then, like, let’s say you’re so happy like, I’m gonna get the award but then you don’t… and you feel so bad. But like, if you don’t expect anything, it’s not as difficult.

Q: But you won. What was it like getting it?

AG: Yeah, so, when I went there, I was so nervous because I saw the other voice actors that were nominated. So many famous people were there, too, like I got to see Angelina Jolie and Kobe Bryant was there, which was amazing. I got to meet them both which was so much fun.  They were so good, I couldn’t believe it. When I got the award, I was just in shock because this will be, like, marked in history! I was just so happy that a lot of people appreciated the hard work that people put in the film, the heart they put in the film… all the work they put to make it. Just ‘Coco’ in general, all the awards they were nominated for! They even broke a world record! It just made me feel so happy to see that a lot of people were appreciating the movie. It made me feel so good about myself that I even got an award which was amazing and alongside so many people that were experts in animation, like, so many people that were there that have been doing this for so many years.

Q: Well, what was your first acting job?

AG: My first acting job? I’ve never had that question before!

How is it possible he has never been asked this question?! Oh, yeah… he’s thirteen! Anthony giggles for being asked the question, something he does throughout the entire interview. He’s quite amusing to watch. I can’t wait to see the films he does in the future and how he turns his flair for the dramatic and his strengths and gifts into Oscar gold someday. Back to the interview…

AG: Well, I remember my first acting job. I was very young. It was for an Oscar Meyer commercial. About two or three years ago, I filmed another Oscar Meyer commercial and what’s funny about that is that in the commercial, I was with Renee Victor, which plays Abuelita in the movie (Coco) and that was amazing because we didn’t even know her, and we were going to be in the same movie!

Q: What did you have to do to get the part in this film?

AG: So, I auditioned when I was nine years old and what I had to do to get the part? I really had to put a lot of emotion in the voice and I really pretended that I was in the situation, like, if my family didn’t support me… if I was going through this journey… if I was in Miguel’s shoes. That was something that really helped me. So, I just said it like if it was me… like, it was something I would say. It turned out great.

Q: I bet it was a lot of fun.

AG: It was just so much fun getting to explore a different universe and getting to explore different things I didn’t think I’d get to experience.

Q: I heard you got to sing in your audition.

AG: Yes! What’s also cool, and I read this in a magazine I think, it said I was auditioning just for a temporary voice and I was like, ‘Wait! I didn’t know that!’ (Laughs) I was like, ‘Woah! Really?!’ They told me, later on, that Miguel was just gonna sing Remember Me but because they saw that I was able to sing, they actually added Poco Loco, The World Es Mi Familia, Proud Corazón. That… that was just, like, amazing! I couldn’t believe that.

Since my first audition, when I went to Pixar, (I knew it was about music) I was like, ‘Wait, can I sing for you guys?!’ (Laughs, smiles) And so, I did sing. I sang a song in Spanish and they loved it so much and I was so happy to show them what I’ve been doing since I was four years old. I never knew that singing would come in handy for a role! (Laughs)

Q: I loved the emphasis on family in the movie. Would you say there was a representation that you identified with, like, in terms of your own family and upbringing? 

AG: Yeah, yeah! I knew coming into this film that family’s important cuz like, I wouldn’t be here if it weren’t for my family. I started singing because of my brothers. They started singing and inspired me to sing. They grew up doing street performance and dancing in (inaudible) a very Mexican place. There’s a lot of restaurants there and music; that’s all you hear… it’s just amazing. My two sisters would dance and sing and my brothers would dance and sing. I would just look up to them and I would, like, see that a lot of people would enjoy their performances and would have a smile on their face and they would clap, then I see my brothers would feel happy. Well, because of them, I started singing. That’s why I feel that family is important. It also shows that message in ‘Coco’ which I really resonated with a lot. And also, I wouldn’t be here if it wasn’t for my parents, for the support they give me and for always being there every step of the way.

Unfortunately, Miguel doesn’t have that in the movie because his family has banned music for their whole life. Miguel could have shined shoes for the rest of his life but he decided to follow his heart and follow his passion and, umm, be a musician which is what he loved to do. And that’s one of the things that I… I really look up to Miguel because he can serve as a role model and a leader to many of the kids who have a passion and many other kids who want to sing and want to play the guitar, so I feel that he’s a leader. I’m happy to do the voice of Miguel.

Q: Is seeing your heritage in films like ‘Coco’ important to you?

AG: This movie was amazing because it was very unique to all the other Disney•Pixar movies. Obviously, they make you laugh, they make you cry but this one also touches on the Mexican tradition and this was very unique.  It touches on the wonderful celebration of the Day of the Dead. A lot of people didn’t even know the celebration even existed, or they thought it was just like Halloween but it’s actually totally different. It’s about remembering your ancestors and connecting with them again and to know they’re not gone. They’re still here with you, their spirits are still with you, and that’s one of the things I love most about the movie! It taught other people about the culture so, yeah… representation is important because a lot of people learned many things along the way.  It also touches on the importance of family and follow your dreams but besides that, there’s (sic) not many movies that show the celebration of the Day of the Dead. For Disney•Pixar to do a movie about it and represent many Latinos is just amazing and I feel so proud to be a part of that representation and to be doing the voice of Miguel.

Q: You’re from a big family, correct?

AG: We’re five. My little brother is nine, I’m thirteen and my older brother, who inspired me, is fifteen… and my two older sisters, who go to university now. We’ve all been into singing, we’ve all been into music. We all sing and we all act. See, my little brother just copied me every day. Every time he wins an audition he’s like, ‘I’m catching up to you!’ He takes it like a challenge and that’s what makes it fun. That’s why he loves doing it. In fact, I’m always there to help him in any audition. To support him and, yeah, it’s kind of like a competition but it’s also fun and we help each other out. That’s the good part of having people there that do the same thing to be there for you and help you… so that’s cool.

Q:  What’s your best advice for young people who want to get into film?

AG: To just do what you love! If you’re having fun doing it, then do it.  I really love singing and acting so I’m doing it! Thankfully, I have the support from my parents and my siblings so it’s easy for me to do it. And, just follow your heart, do what you love and never give up! Be really resilient… don’t do something you don’t love. You only live once! Miguel could have just done shoes, shined shoes for the rest of his life, but he decided to follow his heart and that’s good advice for other people… to just follow their heart. Do what you love and there’s always a happy ending! 


He smiles when we’re done.  This is a signal not only of how happy he was to have been the part of such an outstanding film but of the fun he had while being interviewed. Being interviewed is something he’ll master soon as it is this interviewer’s opinion that Anthony Gonzalez will be spoken to a lot through his many successful years in show business that is to come.  It was a true pleasure getting to know this young actor and be in the presence of such a phenomenal talent and bountiful spirit of intensity. Before long, he’ll get his sea legs and navigate his way through promotional tours with ease and I hope he never loses sight of the fact that the reason doing these events is not just for promoting a film, a DVD or himself but for his fans, soon to be in the millions, to get to know him better. I hope this Q&A helps you do just that but here’s some info on the home release of the film.

*Here is information on the release of the Blu-Ray